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Hello

PostPosted: Fri Nov 12, 2010 1:30 pm
by Adana Man
I'm new here. I live in the UK and love the Turkish breeds. I fly Anana and dolapci and enjoy them very much. Hope to chat with others.

Re: Hello

PostPosted: Sat Nov 13, 2010 5:55 pm
by Kurt Gürsu
Hi,
Wellcome a board.
Just saw your Dolapcis.
Nice looking birds.

Re: Hello

PostPosted: Sun Nov 14, 2010 5:56 am
by Adana Man
Hi thanks. I did have kelebeks but i hav'nt the time and space to keep so many breeds. I did enjoy them very much tho. Do you fly yours Kurt?

Re: Hello

PostPosted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 11:26 am
by Kurt Gürsu
Last year we moved into a new house and before the move I gave my Kelebek kit away to reduce the number of birds.
Just kept the breeders.
This year I have been focusing on settling the Takla young birds and building the coops.
I should be set by the begining of the next flight season around April to put together another kit.
I am sure it will start with a few birds as the babies leave the nests but I like to have a 20 bird team to fly.
They are just a different type of fun then the Taklas.
Plus once they are trained I can fly them during the hawk season also which is impossible with Takla.

Re: Hello

PostPosted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 11:58 am
by Adana Man
Sounds good Kurt how do the kelebeks deal with the hawks? Ive had the peregrine chasing both my Dolapci and Adana but did not catch either but did take 10 feathers out of a dolapci's tail.

Re: Hello

PostPosted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 7:42 pm
by Kurt Gürsu
Well, the number of hawks in US is different then what we are used to in Turkey.
A lot different!
Basically, there are 6 months out of the year when we can fly birds comfortably here.
During this time there are some local hawks but it is bearable.
However, from the second week of October to second week of April everybody and their cousins come down from Canada.
During this time it becomes impossible to fly.
2 years ago I kept going and finished the hawk season well before the season ended after loosing 38 birds.
Almost all of those birds were takla.
Some went to Cooper Hawks and some to Peregrines.

Any way, the Kelebeks are probably the second best breed to deal with hawks in my experience.
Only breed that out did them was Mülâkat I got a chance to watch during one of my visits to back home a few years ago.
Both are almost 100% Cooper safe.
The Peregrine on the other hand is a different story.
That is one impressive hunting machine.
I should say Mülâkat faired better then Kelebeks against the Peregrine when the attack was visible, as in the birds spot the falcon at a distance before the attack takes place.
While Kelebeks get nervous and start their preventive maneuvers the Mülâkats in a split second make it to the coops regardless of what altitude they are at.
When the attack is the most common way for a Peregrine and it shows up from a much higher altitude then the birds and is already in a dive when the birds can see him then Kelebek is a better breed to have out there.

Now, every once in a while they do get blind sided especially in overcast situations but on a clear day it is very unlikely for them to get caught.
The season I lost all those birds, most of them went to a pair of Peregrines nesting on the city hall building in downtown.
There is a webcam attached to the nest site so I could actually see some of my birds being fed to the newly hatched falcons.
Click on the Webcam link

That year, I watched one of my red and white pied Kelebek hens get attacked at a height where I could barely see the birds.
Because of the way Kelebeks fly, I actually thought it was another Kelebek maneuvering on the kit to disperse them like they usually play.
It was a peregrine.
It chased the hen right on the tail, maybe a yard behind her for about a hundred feet, 90 degrees to the ground.
To make up for his diving speed the hen actually had to fly her dive at full speed.
Right when he got to her tail she broke, made a U turn and went up 10-15 feet.
It is an impressive turn at that speed and what was more impressive was the way the peregrine copied the move to the T with that body size.
I watched spins, upside down flights, going through trees, climbs, and dives you name it and that big all falcon did not miss a beat.
It all ended with the hen breaking a dive by slamming in to the wire floor of the coop through the door.
She bounced up like a tennis ball.
I thought that chase lasted around 20 minutes and I was on a call when it took place with a pigeon guy and he got a chance to hear play by play and told me it was only 3 to 4 minutes.
Excitement of it must have made me see it in slow motion.
That bird is one of my breeders now and named by one of my friends as "Apache" after a similar performance.
When you decide to fly them during the hawk season they give you some unforgettable moments these guys.
The catch is you have to be able to stomach it when it goes south.
I have seen 2 coopers slam in to the wall of my garage in the old house trying to get these guys.

Good stuff.

Re: Hello

PostPosted: Wed Nov 17, 2010 12:44 pm
by Adana Man
Brilliant story Kurt i hope i dont get to many attacks here in the uk it is not has bad as you get it over there. I see you used my video of the Adana in your 2nd link i have posted another small clip i took on monday take a peak.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q8__RoKohaM

Re: Hello

PostPosted: Thu Nov 18, 2010 8:01 pm
by Kurt Gürsu
Hi,
Steve, right?
Those videos were sent by our member Ugur Buyukolmez, who ran into them browsing for other videos and I thought they were pretty decent performances, considering the difficulty of catching their dives with a video camera.
However, I must admit, even though I noticed that video was from England, not for a second I thought it would be from a person other then a Turkish guy who is originally from Adana.
You have surprised and impressed me my friend.
Well done!
Now tell us a bit about how you got in to this breed and got the necessary information to get them to perform at that level?
I am asking because first of all I am very curious but also over the years I have seen many people keep Adana and have never seen one get them to fly properly let alone get them to perform, other then the people who have grown up with in those birds in Adana.

Re: Hello

PostPosted: Sat Nov 20, 2010 7:56 am
by Adana Man
Hello Kurt firstly thank you for the compliments.
Yes my name is Steve i live in Manchester England. I am 35 years old and ive kept pigeons since i was 12. Ive kept all kinds of pigeons tumbler,fantails,modenas,pouters and all these birds ive flown even the modenas back when modenas were much smaller than they are today. So ive always loved to fly pigeons. I discoverd Birmingham rollers when i was about 14-15 and have kept them ever since then in 2003 i read about Doneks how they dived and spiralled and it interested me instantly so i began to read some more thats when i read about the Adana or as we call them in the uk Dewlaps. I had to have some so the enquires started. A friend of mine George Mason a top roller flyer had friends in Germany and asked them if they could purchase some dewlaps and sure enough 2 pair were sent to George in 2004, i borrowed these 2 pairs and bred 5. The 1st 1 i bred i tried to fly on her own but she kept landing on the roof tops and wouldnt fly on her own, so i tried hand launching her with the rollers and she started to fly straight away. I had read on the internet about holding a white pigeon in 1 hand and making it flap its wings to make the adana dive so i tried and sure enough the mealy hen dived down i was made up. When i look back her diving was mediocre compared with the performances i get now and i will be honest these birds have been challenge to say the least.
Over the years ive read and read on various websites about these great birds but never found any step by step training methods.
Ive visited a few turkish forums and used translation tools to try and learn the proper ways but when translated a lot doesnt make sense. So ive kinda stitched things together along with flying the birds and using trial and error to get them right. I have them pretty much nailed now and all the hard work has payed off but there as been a few times ive nearly gave up and let the birds go and if it wasnt for how great the Adana look i probably would have. I would like to thank the people of Adana for giving us this magnificent bird i dont think another day will pass when i dont have these birds in my company.
Steve...

Re: Hello

PostPosted: Sun Nov 21, 2010 11:20 pm
by Kurt Gürsu
Hi Steve,
All I can say is if you fly Modenas, then you are my friend a true pigeon man.
Not many can say they have.

Adana Man wrote:The 1st 1 i bred i tried to fly on her own but she kept landing on the roof tops and wouldnt fly on her own, so i tried hand launching her with the rollers and she started to fly straight away....

I am gladd you didn't give up with that hen.
Many people do.

Adana Man wrote:i will be honest these birds have been challenge to say the least

I know exacty what you mean and I am sure many people reading your comments will agree 100% with you.
But it looks like you are definately getting the fruits of your labor now.

Adana Man wrote:Over the years ive read and read on various websites about these great birds but never found any step by step training methods.

This is true for many of the performing breeds unfortunately and probably the reason why they are so scarce and when they are found they tend to be kept as show breeds.
It seems information is a lot more importand then finding the right stock when it comes to a new performing breed.
On top of it you probably picked one of the thoughest breeds to deal with also.

Adana Man wrote:Over the years ive read and read on various websites about these great birds but never found any step by step training methods.
Ive visited a few turkish forums and used translation tools to try and learn the proper ways but when translated a lot doesnt make sense. So ive kinda stitched things together along with flying the birds and using trial and error to get them right. I have them pretty much nailed now and all the hard work has payed off but there as been a few times ive nearly gave up and let the birds go and if it wasnt for how great the Adana look i probably would have. I would like to thank the people of Adana for giving us this magnificent bird i dont think another day will pass when i dont have these birds in my company.

Well, online translations are usefull to a degree. They stop being helpfull when the text includes many words unique to pigeon world and a specific dialect like Adana area.
I don't even understand some of the words they use to be honest.
But, it looks like you got what you needed in your search to get where you are.

Adana Man wrote:i read about the Adana or as we call them in the uk Dewlaps

I think the terminolgy of Dewlap gets most of the new people to this breed in trouble.
It pretty much puts them together with many other breeds, which some of them are extremely similar to them in the exterior.
People end up getting birds thinking they are Adanas and never get anywhere with them after all that efford.
It can be pretty discouraging.
What is interesting this is true in Turkey also.
My mother is from the city of Gaziantep, which is right next to Adana on the map but in pigeon culture so far away.
In Gaziantep they keep predominantly war pigeons and many of those breeds are Dewlaps.
To the pigeon people of that city there is no difference between Adana and some of their breeds but the birds that come from Adana are just not strong though weather fiers in war conditions.
Then again you could not make a dewlap out of a war squadron to dive if his life depended on it.
I should say they would dive but only a Adana keeper would know that is no dive.

If you do have some can you post a few photos of your Adanas?

Take care

Re: Hello

PostPosted: Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:47 am
by Adana Man
Hello Kurt i no longer keep Modenas but i do wish i would of kept my original birds the Modenas of today are way to big to fly.
My birds were much smaller but still the same round like ball and when they flew they had big round edged wings with a very fast wing beat like a duck. They also kitted together nice and flew very fast.
I have posted some pics of my Adana in the Adana section i will take some more up to date and better pictures soon.
Steve...